No voices were raised against 'Nepal being a Hindu country ' in any of the peoples movement in Nepal. Then why these bloody politicians decides to amend the constitution to make Nepal a secular state? I am pretty much sure if people were informed that the Jan Andolan would make the country a secular one, the streets of Kathmandu would not have been flooded with people during the Aandolan..
Politicians talk of respecting people's voice. They then do not have the right to amend the constitution to make a decision on the matter that was not voiced by people. There was nothing wrong with Nepal as Hindu country...If we want to change this, there should be referendum for that. Bloody politicians, killers do not deserve any right to decide against people's aspiration.
Hinduism basically is not the religion, its a culture. It respects all religions...we never had any religious dispute in the country. When things were going smoothly with that whywas the need for change?

Vhootee,

I am also Buddhist raised in Hindu tradition, may be this is what is called DEMOCRACY, blame the minorities for every problems nation has to face, we cannot prove wrong coz majority rules.

Enough time has been wasted in this thread. My last question, Should I be proud of being nepali or second class minority who has to go thro referendum for my basic right, identity.

good night guys, learned a lot.

Go for refurendum......Only Nepali people directly decide such issue....

To All the Buddist and Rithhi Jasus and Votee,

You guys are right but what you need to realize is do you want secularism for name sake or in practical.What Nepal had before was true secularism.No extreme hindus , now unnecessarily you touch the sensitive issue that to forcefully impose in the people they things will go wrong.And you know it will.

I remember vootee , we had long discussion when Nepal was declared secular , i told that time extreme hindus are going to fight back.And thing are moving in that direction.country is in total chaos and everyone wants their rights now!!!

Would you rathere prefer with buddist philosophy that no lives are lost due to religion war or would you prefer to be live in harmony where you have freedom of religion, you were getting religious holidays , i don't know any incident that buddist or any religion being discrimanated for the sole reason of religion in old nepal(what ever!!!)

jassus ji, once again, hitler ko system was not democratic. he was not voted into the office. under his system, people did not vote to set or forward an agenda... yes us does not have slavery now tara look at its history there was a time when it did practice that... yes majority of the democratic countries are secular.. that too is decided by the majority... although majority happened to be christians..
jassus ji there is democracy so there is this enlighment for equal rights and equal treatment of all peoples... if there were no democracy, minorities would not even have an option...demcracy sets the stage... but it is a system where people decide... and majority push the agenda and make it happen thru votes and public opinion... i agree with ur sentiments but ur comparision of democracy with hitler and other bla bla shows you are being guided by ur emotions and not basic democratic ideals.
if 80% are hindus and lets say if every one counts, then to come up with 40% jassus ji you need 20% out of that population and all of 20% non hindu to come up with your number.. now is that a possibility? are mere a gussing game?

KEEP THE FUGGING RELIGIONAND STATE SEPERATE. ITS DONE GET OVER IT.

AS THE POLITICAL CLOUT CHANGES IN NEPAL WITH ALL THE DIFFERENT ETHNIC GROUPS DEMANDING DIFFERENT THINGS, WE DO NOT ... STRESS DO NOT NEED ANOTHER FUGGING MOVEMENT TO DESTABALIZE THE FUGGING COUNTRY. FUGGING IDIOTS HAVE NOTHING BETTER TO DO AND TO CREATE PROBLEMS. NEPALI ECONOMY IS SINKING LIKE A FUGGING STONE, PEOPLE ARE HAVING A HARDER TIME TRYING TO PUT THE DAILY BREAD ON THE TABLE AND THESE MORONS KEEP COMING WITH ALL THIS UN-NECESSARY BULLSHIT EVERYDAY.

Livewire,

India is the biggest democracy in the world. Did India become secular through referendum ???? She is the root of hindu fundamentalism, fundamentalists may form their government thro voting but they cannot give their sole identity to country which represents them only, that is democracy.

They should have been asking for referendum in their own country,...... if it was possible there is no way, India would have been secular. Nobody is asking for special priorities, or quotas. What different is it that mob rule ........ where everthing is decided by majority.

IMI, Ur words sound threat to me, only represent what you believe, do not speculate, we are only discussing here. I donot consider myself second to none, then why should I only compromise.

bathoomcoffee,

Its just a discussion, nobody is going on streets whatever happens.

Livewire,

If you are saying India became secular or she was divided into pakistan because majority pushed for it, or majority made it possible ...... as in ur form of democracy ......... I am not buying ur story. Ur thought is not more that a mere blabbing to me too ...... If ur form of democracy was the real one .... sorry to tell you it doesnot exist in true democratic worlds ....... it may only be practical in radical muslim countries .... like Iran.

I came up with 40%, taking into account that,.. people like you will be wise enough to go for secularism, if u urself are questioning me, it proves u are also guided by ur emotions.
I am not, I am newar and as most of the newar I am confused between two religions. I pactice both, won't deny I may be more lenient towards Buddhism ...... but I celebrate more hindu festivals than buddhist. Don't get me wrong, I am just speaking my conscience.

ImI bro,
secularism within hinduism !!! is it possible ??? ....... its like " masu khayera vegiterian hune " jastai ho. In one hand you say, there was secularism before than now, on the other hand you say the extremist hindus will rise if we donot retain hinduism........... Is that the sign of secularism we had ???

jassus ji,
so we should follow india regarding this issue and declare nepal secular?.. u don't want to ask ur country folks tara want to look south for answers??r.. you have no idea what democracy is as u often compare it with mob rule , with iran, where hitler, neither of which allow freedom to raise contengious issue like the one we are talking about. how can u compare democracy with iran? in a democracy, majority sets the agenda and governs too. it does allow voices from those who don't form a majority. ur version of democracy ma minorities lay the ground rules on debatable issues. that is not democracy. democratic system listens to majority+minority.. but who ever has the most votes sets the agenda.. if minority were to set the agenda that would be contradictory to democratic ideals by neglecting the majority. it would be like in iraq under saddam where the minority sunnis set the agenda for majority shi'a... that was dictatorship.. there is nothing wrong in asking nepalese people for answer.. if they want hidu state fine.. btw there was nothing hardcore hindu law besides gai marne clause before nepal became a secular state. there is nothing wrong in nepal being a secular state after all it shows inclusive nature of governance and as far as hindu traditions go,they will not diminish if we become secular.. it does not really matter which one we choose, but jassus why don't u want to ask the rest of nepalis. are u scared that they will choose hindu nation because they are hindu? we know u are already confused and emotional..cannot be sure if u are arguing with the right state of mind or murky conscience!!!

Look livewire sathi,

you can beat around the bushes as much as you like ..... but u havenot answered my questions ........... You can call me whatever you like if it pleases you, ..... I don't mind if they do voting on it or keep nepal as hindu nation without voting ??? scared ???? r u crazy ??? I have lived my whole life as a citizen of only hindu nation, what difference will it make if it still remains the same ??? scared are the people like you who are whining abt the issue, when secularism has already been passed .......

r u trying to make me laugh ???? by accusing me to be following Indians ...... who is seeding fundamentalism in Nepal ..... not chinese people I guess ..... You are the voice of Indian fundamentalists, and u are accusing me ??? You give me example of ur type of democracy where countries were made secular by popular demand of majorities.


"ur version of democracy ma minorities lay the ground rules on debatable issues."

I don't see anyone asking for special treatments here, equal treatment is the born right ra yesko lagi agenda chahincha jasto lagdaina malai, I know what you mean, Ur accusation is unrelated to my point. Reserved seat mageko ho ra agenda banauna lai ??? Give me one good example of ur type of democracy, please include secularism, don't just beat around bushes.

What ever guys but I agree with ritthe_jasus

ofcourse i will give u an example of this dude... us attacked iraq. most people supported the war so did bush. there was an election bush won. his opposite kerry who opposed the war and lost the election. now recently, war did not go well. majority of people disapproved the war as a result the republican party, that is seen as the one the supports the war lost. democratic party that is seen as the one opposing the war won a lot of seats in both,the upperhouse, senat, and lower house, house of representatives. ofcourse there are countless examples of majoirty setting up the agenda and their agenda getting pushed.
jassus ji, don't put words in my mouth i have never asked nepal to go back to a hindu state. i am just questioning a political decision in democracy that did not include the voice of all nepalis. i am glad that there is a secular nepal. but can i say the same for the rest? can you?
with regards to other democracies.. they had to become secular because they carried a baggage of religious hatred... german nazis or indian communal violence... europe thruout its history has seen religious war.. so there was a need for secularism.. in nepal there is no such baggage...we don't even have hindu laws.. we used to have one gai mareko law.. that could have been taken out.. only other thing is the king.. the king is regarded the head of the hindu state.. he was considered a god.. but he is on his way out too.. so what is wrong with nepal being hindu nation? how does that exclude other minorities? Buddha jayanti ma national holiday kahile thiyena? ki muslim haru nepal ma aauna darauchan? ki christian missionaries haru were percecuted? when were they excluded.. feri secular nation hudai ma hindu haru dasai namaune haina.. sabai festivities rokine haina? so why all the fuss? sure secularism is a great idea.. because at the end of the day secular hudai ma hindu culture ta finish hune haina.. instead secularism is an all inclusive gesture... i am for it dude but are MOST nepalese on the same page?
furthermore,jassus by ur own account u said u were confused.. and u are pointing fingers to me making all these wild accusations that i am a voice of fundamentalist bla ba.. on the previous post u were pointing out to india, the largest secular democracy to prove ur point... now u are distancing urself from india.. what are u? a politician?
once again what do MOST nepalis want? not just a FEW.. not just a few politicians for political reasons..

Raised in a Hindu family myself, and with much respects to Hinduism, I am kind of curious to know what would our Hindu brothers here think if I borrow their logical notion to say:

Nepal must be a Buddhist nation because the Buddha was born in Nepal.

Why Hinduism? Just because it has been Hindu nation for ages? What is wrong with secular nation? Hindus can just have as much freedom as Nepal was in otherwise Hindu nation. And, with the same token if you say, minority religions had same freedom regardless of it being Hindu nation (before it was announced secular nation), I will repeat the same question, "Nepal must be a Buddhist nation because our Buddha was born here."

And what is majority? "Greatest good for greatest people"? Ruling with 51 votes out of 100 votes is an old system. Even in the past when some bills were passed there needed to be 2/3 of the votes.

.
re: "what nepal had was true secularism"
"Would you rathere prefer with buddist philosophy that no lives are lost due to religion war or would you prefer to be live in harmony where you have freedom of religion, you were getting religious holidays , i don't know any incident that buddist or any religion being discrimanated for the sole reason of religion in old nepal(what ever!!!)"

was eid a public holiday?
was christmas?
were atheists allowed to slaughter cows?

" You guys are right but what you need to realize is do you want secularism for name sake or in practical.What Nepal had before was true secularism.No extreme hindus , now unnecessarily you touch the sensitive issue that to forcefully impose in the people they things will go wrong.And you know it will. "

wow. how tolerant of you. and youre right. there were no extreme hindus. clearly, you are not one of those shiva sena types. you have the spirit of mother teresa in you. man of peace, just like nathuram godse

dont go on harping about true secularism when you have no idea what it means

i am still wondering. In nepal, how many want nepal to be secular? Was it people's choice or a political maneuver?

Yeah ! Nepal should be a MORMON NATION.
and let MItti Nut run the country.

LOL @ Bathroom Coffee. Btw, did you know Romney was a missionary in France? And that Mormon missionaries are pretty active in Nepal? Maybe your wish will come true :P he he

Hope all's well - havent seen you in a while.

livewire,

looking at the way u write, u look more like a politician to me. India, being the largest democracy in the world, I used her just for an example to tell you how decision is made in democratic country, I have used US too in my previous threads you never picked it up ...... u only picked India and accused me to be following Indians.

I was asking for an example concerning basic rights like religion, color, caste and u came up with an example of war. So if I follow ur type of democracy ...... do we need to go thro agendas for equal treatment for all castes too ??? What difference is there between issues like caste, religion, color ??? These all come into basic rights for me.

In your own example, if secularism can be a remedy of religious violence in India and German, how can it again be the source of chaos in nepalese context ???

I really admire ur crafty writing technique, you picked a word "confused" out of the whole sentence and trying to make myself believe that I am typing all these out of confusion and frustration. Please read it again.

"I am not, I am newar and as most of the newar I am confused between two religions. I pactice both, won't deny I may be more lenient towards Buddhism ...... but I celebrate more hindu festivals than buddhist. Don't get me wrong, I am just speaking my conscience."

what did you understand out of it ??? Did I mean I am confused of the secularism issue ??? Let me explain in simple language so that you won't pick any words out of it and use against me." Hinduism and Buddhism is like my father and mother, I may have more affetion to one, but I cannot choose one out of them " thats what I meant and above that secularism is not about hinduism and buddhism only, It involves every known and unknown religions, I just believe they should not be represented under others identity.

Who do you think is making a fuss here ??? Me ??? Do you think I started the thread ??? It may not be you but A guy who thinks like you started this thread. The decision of secularism has been made, if u were true supporter of secularism, you wouldnot have come up with complains, coz u still have hope if this would have gone thro popular vote, you could have retained hindu status of the country.

Silence speaks louder than voice ........ you don't need to cry out loud for me to understand that u favor hinduism, if u were in favor of secularism, you would not have been discussing with me, trying to prove how confused I am.

Get out of the box and try to think being Human.

It may have been done with political interest but truth is always truth in every form. People were happy before secularism, but since the issue of right have been raised we cannot deny it. There are still bonded labors in some parts of Nepal, its ok until the voice doesnot rise against it, if it does ...... right shouldnot be denied, shouldnot be asked to go thro referendum. thats all I believe.